Author Topic: Just one question...  (Read 1616 times)

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Offline Zigatron

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Re: Just one question...
« Reply #20 on: April 02, 2016, 05:49:27 pm »
Well, how am I supposed to know there was a delay to the updating to the online list?
If it could be possible, maybe fix the update time, as it has potential to cause issues as we can see here.

Thanks for letting me know though, appreciated.
It does actually state the 15 minutes delay right above where the names start ^^
http://i.imgur.com/ZuNlTUF.jpg
The delay hasn't really been an issue before and I'm not sure how changeable it is, however if you click on " x guests, X users, X hidden" button you can see the actions of the visible users with a time stamp of when they are doing it. If the time stamp was 5 minutes ago it's likely they are now AFK for example
It doesn't explicitly state a delay, just says who/what people have done in the last 15.
A misinterpretation, human error.
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Re: Just one question...
« Reply #21 on: April 02, 2016, 05:50:55 pm »
Alright guys. Sorry that it took me so long to write the post. I might get a few details wrong (and I would be thankful if any misinformation that I have is corrected).

Anyway, let's get on with it.

The reason for your warning, Zigatron, could have been a wording problem (I went back to Unpopular Opinions, which is where I suppose that the argument happened). Things like remarks about reactions or behavior of other members is not tolerated in the Debate & Discussion board, and yes. Even small ones are not tolerated (these usually get reported, if anything goes under the radar it's usually because no one decided to report or it was too small for anyone to notice. Usually, in arguments like that, things like that tend to get more noticed because of multiple reads of somebody's post because of the very nature of the argument that is taking place).

Next point:

This site, as you described it, IS a hugbox. I myself have described it as such in the past, and that is really not a bad thing for the purpose that the forum serves. The forum is supposed to make teens feel safe, offering an atmosphere in which they can express themselves. Usually, disagreements can happen, and things can escalate pretty quickly, but these are usually pretty rare (I'd suppose you would call something like this echochamber, seeing as the same opinion is shared by a lot of our community). Still, I've seen my fair share of disagreements that have stayed peaceful, so it is not impossible for the site to hold a discussion without the members getting on each other's throats.

The last point I'll address is this:

It has been discussed many times taking down the Debate & Discussion board, but every time it has been decided to leave it up, seeing as it's not fair to take a whole board down when many members can still hold a discussion. It is also useful to hear of events that happen around the Internet or the world that other teens deem important enough to talk about.

If you believe that I missed an important point, please do make me know it. I'm kinda rushing this since time is on my back, but I'll try to get back here as fast as I can so that I can continue to explain until at least an Admin gets here.

PS: While I do understand your tactic to bring attention to your post and why you used it (I admit it is indeed a good one), I have to ask you to not do it again. It is indeed a bit disrespectful, and doesn't put you in a very positive light. Again, I understand it and I don't feel wronged by it, but I don't recommend it and I just ask you not to use it
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Offline Zigatron

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Re: Just one question...
« Reply #22 on: April 02, 2016, 06:13:03 pm »
I got my response. Feel free to lock the thread as no other responses are necessarily needed.

Quote
The reason for your warning, Zigatron, could have been a wording problem (I went back to Unpopular Opinions, which is where I suppose that the argument happened). Things like remarks about reactions or behavior of other members is not tolerated in the Debate & Discussion board, and yes. Even small ones are not tolerated (these usually get reported, if anything goes under the radar it's usually because no one decided to report or it was too small for anyone to notice. Usually, in arguments like that, things like that tend to get more noticed because of multiple reads of somebody's post because of the very nature of the argument that is taking place).
Okay, my counterargument in the debate over religion was fine, but the response I received was on the angry side, and I told them to "not get pissy". Flamewars aren't necessary and it looked like it would've became one so I told them to chill. I think a new set of rules should be written up if removal of the board is disallowed.

Quote
This site, as you described it, IS a hugbox. I myself have described it as such in the past, and that is really not a bad thing for the purpose that the forum serves. The forum is supposed to make teens feel safe, offering an atmosphere in which they can express themselves. Usually, disagreements can happen, and things can escalate pretty quickly, but these are usually pretty rare (I'd suppose you would call something like this echochamber, seeing as the same opinion is shared by a lot of our community). Still, I've seen my fair share of disagreements that have stayed peaceful, so it is not impossible for the site to hold a discussion without the members getting on each other's throats.
I grasp that the hugbox thing keeps people safe. However when something small, for example a wrong word choice, has a potential to cause a fight and incur warnings is a little startling. Things shouldn't be that locked down.

Quote
It has been discussed many times taking down the Debate & Discussion board, but every time it has been decided to leave it up, seeing as it's not fair to take a whole board down when many members can still hold a discussion. It is also useful to hear of events that happen around the Internet or the world that other teens deem important enough to talk about.
I see. But if people are having a negative reaction to posts, which my posts were legitimately okay, then people should take that people are going to disagree with them and that the world doesn't revolve around them/their opinion into consideration.

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Re: Just one question...
« Reply #23 on: April 02, 2016, 06:19:50 pm »
Thanks Proto.

I've been incredibly busy this weekend so I can't get too involved with this, but just a note to say that the Debate board serves as a place for education too. Its for extended discussions too, not just debates, where people can educate others and learn something about in-depth topics. This has happened there, and can happen as long as all parties are mature. We honestly don't get flamewars too often, especially really bad ones, so we don't think its fair to close a whole board because of a few incidents. Yes there will ALWAYS be flamewars, but if that board wasn't there they would simply carry out into other areas of the site. We've had another solution worked out for a while, but I'm having some technical issues with it.

Regarding the activity thing, I personally browse the forum while I'm on break at work, in class etc. just as a casual thing. Just because a staff member is online doesn't mean they're in a position to discuss issues or help with X technical thing. While your point about "will respond later" is a good one, I can also see that angering people, so I'm kinda at a loss here.

I will leave this up for further input, unless OP really wants it locked.
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Re: Just one question...
« Reply #24 on: April 04, 2016, 04:02:41 am »
This brings up a good question: can FT be a hugbox while simultaneously facilitating the clashing of beliefs that will inevitably occur on a debate board? Probably not, in my opinion. This has happened repeatedly for years and there is no reason to believe that it won't happen again and again indefinitely. Frankly, you can't have FT be both a hugbox and a center of debate without infringing on (if not completely destroying) the purpose of both objectives. Leaning towards the hugbox ideology is probably good considering the demographic here, but having the world "debate" opens the board up to escalating arguments, which is obviously not what we're going for here.
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Offline Dyno Fluff

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Re: Just one question...
« Reply #25 on: April 04, 2016, 04:34:31 am »
This brings up a good question: can FT be a hugbox while simultaneously facilitating the clashing of beliefs that will inevitably occur on a debate board? Probably not, in my opinion. This has happened repeatedly for years and there is no reason to believe that it won't happen again and again indefinitely. Frankly, you can't have FT be both a hugbox and a center of debate without infringing on (if not completely destroying) the purpose of both objectives. Leaning towards the hugbox ideology is probably good considering the demographic here, but having the world "debate" opens the board up to escalating arguments, which is obviously not what we're going for here.

I think it's already been mentioned in the topic somewhere that we would rather the escalations happen within a controlled board rather than everywhere else on FT.
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Re: Just one question...
« Reply #26 on: April 04, 2016, 05:09:18 am »
This brings up a good question: can FT be a hugbox while simultaneously facilitating the clashing of beliefs that will inevitably occur on a debate board? Probably not, in my opinion. This has happened repeatedly for years and there is no reason to believe that it won't happen again and again indefinitely. Frankly, you can't have FT be both a hugbox and a center of debate without infringing on (if not completely destroying) the purpose of both objectives. Leaning towards the hugbox ideology is probably good considering the demographic here, but having the world "debate" opens the board up to escalating arguments, which is obviously not what we're going for here.

I think it's already been mentioned in the topic somewhere that we would rather the escalations happen within a controlled board rather than everywhere else on FT.

So you're saying that FT should be a hugbox, but with the exception of the debate board? Regardless, the debate board is part of FT and can be viewed by anyone, including the people we're trying to protect. Having a board that encourages dissension and controversy by its mere name is not going to prevent quarrels from happening on the rest of the site.

Additionally, the toxicity often fostered by debate board arguments has spilled over into other parts of the forum on multiple occasions (last summer being a prime example).
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Offline Dyno Fluff

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Re: Just one question...
« Reply #27 on: April 04, 2016, 05:14:53 am »
This brings up a good question: can FT be a hugbox while simultaneously facilitating the clashing of beliefs that will inevitably occur on a debate board? Probably not, in my opinion. This has happened repeatedly for years and there is no reason to believe that it won't happen again and again indefinitely. Frankly, you can't have FT be both a hugbox and a center of debate without infringing on (if not completely destroying) the purpose of both objectives. Leaning towards the hugbox ideology is probably good considering the demographic here, but having the world "debate" opens the board up to escalating arguments, which is obviously not what we're going for here.

I think it's already been mentioned in the topic somewhere that we would rather the escalations happen within a controlled board rather than everywhere else on FT.

So you're saying that FT should be a hugbox, but with the exception of the debate board? Regardless, the debate board is part of FT and can be viewed by anyone, including the people we're trying to protect. Having a board that encourages dissension and controversy by its mere name is not going to prevent quarrels from happening on the rest of the site.

Additionally, the toxicity often fostered by debate board arguments has spilled over into other parts of the forum on multiple occasions (last summer being a prime example).

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Re: Just one question...
« Reply #28 on: April 04, 2016, 09:16:22 am »
So you're saying that FT should be a hugbox, but with the exception of the debate board? Regardless, the debate board is part of FT and can be viewed by anyone, including the people we're trying to protect. Having a board that encourages dissension and controversy by its mere name is not going to prevent quarrels from happening on the rest of the site.

The board can still have "hugbox" like qualities, like respecting each other's opinions, which should be happening anyways. Combined with the fact we no longer allow homo/trans/etc. -phobic things and things like racism disguised as an "opinion", I think we're doing a pretty okay job at evening it out. Every time a flame war happens this discussion comes up, which is understandable--but overall, I don't think that board is as toxic as people imply. We're always going to have disagreements and flame wars no matter how hard we try to stop it.
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